Ep 020 – The Coca-Cola Trail – Tourist Points of Interest in Southern US States

Suburban Folk 0:00
Suburban Folk is now live every Thursday at 5pm. Eastern Standard Time. Just download the pod bean app and search for Suburban Folk or visit Suburban Folk dot pod being calm for the latest topic and login information. We will talk about what I learned from our most recent episode, give previews of episodes to come, chat with our audience and answer any questions they may have. We’re grateful for all of our listeners that tune in and are excited to share the show to a larger audience, subscribing rating and reviewing us on your favorite podcast platform is a big help and be sure to share with your friends as well. For those looking to support us even further, a donation button has been added to our website at Suburban folk.com. All money received will be 100% redirected into advertising and getting the word out about the show. Now sit back and enjoy this episode of health, travel finance, parenting and entertainment. This is the Suburban Folk podcast. I’m looking forward to having some real talk with some real folks. Welcome to the Suburban Folk podcast. I’m your host, Greg My guest today is journalist Larry Jorgensen, who’s worked for newspapers, publications, radio, TV news, and does freelance and assignment writing. He now also writes books and articles on recent American history, including the Coca Cola trail, which features the towns that housed independent Coca Cola bottling plants. Larry, thanks so much for joining the show today. Can we start off by you walking us through your background in writing and then ultimately how you came to writing books about recent American history? Well, my

Unknown Speaker 1:32
background you know, as they say, the visible all started out at a very young age excellent all in high school for working with a weekly newspaper, and from there went to a daily then from there got into the electronic end of those and was in radio news and television news. Mostly writing reporting and producing did some on their TV but most of my on air was in radio, I guess as they say I probably had a face for radio. But from there got into freelancing and assignment work, did some assignment work for United Press and did a lot of freelancing and just decided to pursue writing as one of my careers. I’ve done some other media work as well. But primarily, I’m a news dog because still chasing that story. You know, as far as the, the history and I guess, having come from a background of journalism and news and facts, that’s the kind of writing I do. I like to go find the facts to a story that was or time and place the was gather it all together. add to it. Do things that maybe haven’t been revealed, and put it all together into a nice little package. That’s sort of how we got into the books. Short Stories sort of got out of control, I guess.

Suburban Folk 3:15
So bringing all to gather a bunch of different stories for a particular theme, which obviously will get into the theme of the Coca Cola trail, and you’re based in Louisiana. Have you always been based in Louisiana?

Unknown Speaker 3:28
No, actually, I’m, I’m what they call one of those Damn Yankees. And to explain the difference between a Yankee and a damn Yankee. Yankee is somebody from up north. A damn Yankee is somebody from up north who didn’t go home. And actually I was in the TV and radio in Louisiana, in my earlier days, and, and I like the state. I like the atmosphere here. My career took me on TV in Green Bay and other places, but there was always that kind of soft spot in my heart for, for this the state called Louisiana. And when it got to the point where I could do something about it, I bought a place down here on a Bayou and move back. Here it is. Luke reserved, the great columnist, one said, I nailed my shoes to the ground. And here I am,

Suburban Folk 4:28
I will be interested in maybe some more specifics of like you said, What drew you back because when I started to read through the book, what is exciting for me is I have the bucket list of hitting all 50 states at some point in my life, and admittedly right now one of the big holes in my checklist is the South. So it’s nice for me to be able to go through your book and get some of the different areas of interest that I might want to put on the list, and also, of course, the fact, which I’m sure we’ll get into that there’s a lot of towns that folks probably don’t really know about. And it gives some history I think of, for example, traveling from where I’m at in Virginia, back to Pennsylvania to visit family, you know, you go through these small towns that seemingly don’t have a lot going on. And you’ll see train museum signs, or, of course, in Virginia, Civil War, museums and things like that, that have very specific history that, hey, if I’m being honest, I think others are being honest, they don’t always take the time to see what it’s all about. So I’m really happy to give myself an anchor so that once I plan my trip into the south, again, it’ll give me some history to at least go off of from there. So I’m curious. Well, I’ll just ask you now, are there certain cultural things that you can point to specifically that drew you back to the south to ultimately live?

Unknown Speaker 5:55
Well, I think the thing that drew me back to Louisiana And people know the country is made up of 49 states and Louisiana because it is so different. The people are very warm, very welcoming. The food is outstanding. It’s a lifestyle, it said Live and let live lifestyle, you know, and I like that. It’s no stress. People just take life for what it is sort of that we’re not going to ask a lot of you and don’t to ask a lot of us let’s get Boogie on together, you know, and I like that it’s very conducive to writing because there’s no stress in the rest of your life and it allows you to be creative and and to talk to people and explore you know, avenues of interest. I just, I totally like the state and I like the atmosphere, guys. And often when my old Yankee friends ask why I say, well, it’s not for everybody, but it sure is for me, it fits me perfectly.

Suburban Folk 7:09
But yeah, for the stereotype of the go getters, I guess in the north, maybe they wouldn’t necessarily understand. But that sounds terrific to me

Unknown Speaker 7:17
as far as Live and let live.

Suburban Folk 7:20
So jumping into the Coca Cola trail and was published in 2017. And was this similar to what you mentioned, for your other writings that it came together with a number of different stories you were doing and then brought together under that theme? how did how did it come about? That was what you’re going to write about?

Unknown Speaker 7:38
Well, it’s interesting I was, I had planned to do a freelance travel feature, and there are within 6070 miles of each other, to unique Coca Cola museums with some interesting history. In fact, they are the first and second cracker The book. The first chapter, in the first place is Vicksburg, Mississippi. We’re actually Coca Cola was first bottle. And the second chapter is Monroe, Louisiana. And it’s relatively nearby where there is a Coca Cola museum that recognizes the family, that first bottle of Coca Cola and then went on to become one of the largest Coca Cola bottlers in the country. So I thought that’s too interesting. Nearby, places to visit interesting history would be a good travel piece. So I set out to do that. And by the time I got to place number two, I started to interview people who were in that family and to learn more about it and then they intern told me about others throughout the country. with similar stories, it fascinated me so much that I thought there was more here than just a travel feature. And in talking with these people, I realized that even though there’s probably been 200 books written about Coca Cola, and Coca Cola, corporate, you know, Atlanta, no one had ever written a book that dealt with all the individual bottlers, the businessman, the would be businessmen, entrepreneurs, said, You know, I think there’s a controller, I’m going to bottle Coca Cola, and it was those people and I’ve dedicated the book to them that had it not been for all the independent young entrepreneurs. That said, we think this has potential and they invested money, blood, sweat, and tears. And helping to create tech were instrumental in creating the world’s best known product. And no one has really bothered to put all that together. In fact, I’m doing a sequel, The book has been so well received, that we’re doing a sequel with more of those people. That will be in the second book. They’re amazing. They are the ones that certainly were most influential in creating Coca Cola as we know it now. It’s a great story. And I’ve enjoyed doing it and I’ve met a lot of wonderful people and heard their stories and the process of doing it

Suburban Folk 10:44
just for my own sake. pronounce the name of the same whether you’re mentioning that been hard, and I saying that right.

Unknown Speaker 10:50
Right. It was jovie narn that owned a little soda shop and candy He was, had his own business. And then he distributed to other sort of shots. So one of the things he did is he was serving Coca Cola at the counter by the server from Atlanta, serving it, as many of them were. kalter is a drink. And it was and then he was also distributed the syrup to other soda phones in the area. And it occurred to him that, you know, if this was a bottle, I could get the drink to people in the country, so they wouldn’t have to come to the expert. This was 1890s you know, that was a journey. So he bought a little secondhand bottling machine up in St. Louis, Missouri, because there was there was bottling going on at the time there was the Old South gorilla flavored sodas. So but no one thought about barley Coca Cola. Joe thought I’m gonna try it and it took off for him. And ironically he the first among the first two cases he bottled, he sent them to Coca Cola in Atlanta. And the gentleman aisa canler was at that time owned Coca Cola was making the syrup said he was out back and said this okay, but he didn’t see much interested in it. And as Joe observed, he didn’t even send my bottles back yet. But Joe continued to bottle Coca Cola for five years before Coca Cola recognized that it was something that should be done and then sold the rights to bottle Coca Cola for $1 Got the whole thing going nationally? That was five years later. But you know, you talked about the travel to these places. It’s ironic. Coco, obviously a Coca Cola collector must have been from California sent me a message and said that he was planning his summer vacation around my book. So this kind of ties in with what you were talking about Gregor? planning a trip, selfless things to see.

Suburban Folk 13:31
Yeah. And have you thought about somebody wanting to do that? Did that play any role in how the chapters are made up? Like you mentioned, I obviously I could tell that the first couple chapters are focusing, as you mentioned on somebody that was the first to start bottling seemed to be one of the larger independent operations and then as you get into later chapters, it seems like people maybe that were a little later on into the bottling and would also make sense to me their operations weren’t quite as big probably because of that time. Coca Cola started to bottle on their own. You know, of course you have plenty of information about when they’re getting bought back or anything but but yeah was, was there any thought from your standpoint of it being a geographical way to go and try and experience these

Unknown Speaker 14:20
areas? No, actually, what drove me from one chapter to another two things. First of all, I had a goal to, at least from a travel standpoint, to make a chapter a place where people could go and learn about Coca Cola history, but there was something there, they could see touch and feel, whether it was an old Coca Cola plant that now had become a boutique or a restaurant and brew pub or whatever. In fact, there’s one Coca Cola plant in Georgia, that a young man and his dad Purchase because the young man was a Coca Cola collector, they had so much material, they know what to do with it till they built a Coca Cola. Get it all falling down at that time Coca Cola plant brought it back to life. So these are the type of things I look for, you know what, what is important? Because a history of Coca Cola, like create a Nuka. But also, where can you go see some of this? What what’s there What can I, you know, to that’s a nice plant. But now if it’s just apartment buildings, that’s, you know, I don’t have access to that, I can’t see that. But if it’s a restaurant, or if it’s a neat little boutique mall, like in Griffin, Georgia, I can go in there I can see the coke, what Coca Cola was and what it is now. And that was the motivation behind picking the locations. A lot of them were referred to me as I do. Do the book and would do one chapter. One of the people I talked to in that chapter would say, Are you aware that and that would send me off in another direction. And, and those are the good leads, because these are CocaCola people that knew where there was Coca Cola history, you could still see. And in many cases, they would provide contact names, that family names and so forth. That don’t be in my research.

Suburban Folk 16:32
You mentioned having those additional emphasis points on not only the sites around Coca Cola, but yeah, I will also acknowledge that I like that you have in here. If and when somebody is going to see those particular sites. Here’s what’s there. Now like you said, whether it’s a restaurant or not one that sticks in my mind, I believe it was a town in Kentucky, where they got flooded out and right the owner said where Wherever I find dry land, right that was that was the quote right and then turns it turns out that a brewery ended up there that was called dry land brewery if I’m not mistaken, and I’m assuming based on somewhat based on that story, but yeah, that’s cool that you know, people can use those things to plan a day trip or whatever, you know, they’re trying to do with their vacation. So that if maybe the, the Coca Cola piece doesn’t fill up their whole day, there are other things they can go and take a look at while they’re there.

Unknown Speaker 17:27
Well, that Paducah plant is a beautiful structure. When when it was built, he was determined to build one of the most beautiful plants ever. And today it has become a major visitor at crankin. Besides the brewery, there’s a pizza place hidden there is a couple others date little stores, and there’s a bookstore and just as the building itself as who is You’re naked design that it’s it gives a lot of attention. And again in the book it besides the things that are specific Coca Cola, I try to learn where it’s possible, say while you’re here. Here’s something else for example at Paducah, and this has a tie even back to Vicksburg, there is a river in Paducah, and I write about it in the book that has 2030 murals, representing Paducah history. In fact, the State Historical Society has ranked it as one of the top visitor sites to see Well, as it turns out, one of those murals on that wall are of the Coca Cola plant as it appeared right after it was built. Now to tie that to Vicksburg, Mississippi. There is a similar river wall along the Yazoo River in Vicksburg, that also has a series of those murals, including one of the beaten art soda fountain as it became a bottling operation. The even closer tie to that is the gentleman who painted both of those walls is from Lafayette, Louisiana, he painted both of those, in addition to painting a rather unique girl inside the Coca Cola plant in New Orleans. So here’s his work. He’s sort of become, amongst other things a barrel artist who has brought some Coca Cola back to life that you could see when you’re in those towns. It’s super to mendon, Louisiana where we talk about the plant and how unique it is, but also The museum in mizanin, as the public museum has a special display of Coca Cola memorabilia, and there are many like that around the country

Suburban Folk 20:10
is that the same? Hopefully, I’m not getting my stories crossed here. But you also have a similar comparison to two towns not close to each other, that had like the same signage from a company in Chicago. And even though again, very different parts of the country they happen to contract with the same company and very similar murals is that those two towns or was that even a different example?

Unknown Speaker 20:34
a different example. But, again, I’ve got two chapters in there where I talk about Coca Cola signs and barrels, and how communities and businesses that have found them have gone to great efforts to either restore or to preserve a good example, a wonderful story that I write about it and Oba laka Alabama There was a gentleman that had a family owned hardware store. And he was expanding the store, tore down a wall and they’re behind it was a Coca Cola mural, pristine condition. And the only thing they could figure out is that it was painted outside and then when the store grew, it was covered up by an interior wall. And consequently, it stayed in that almost new condition. It has been certified by Coca Cola as the oldest Audrey stored Coca Cola barrel in the country. It’s beautiful. And we write about that in the book that they had a big celebration to unveil it when they finally took all doubt. And, but it’s typical. There are communities where fundraising efforts were done to preserve Coca Cola miracles. The Coca Cola Bottling Company cold Coca Cola consolidated, which was in Charlotte actually has a program now, where they go around and restore for communities. Some of these historic Coca Cola murals. They all want to know the ones that that communities fell in love with it need to be restored. And there’s a lot of that out there

Suburban Folk 22:30
going back to if somebody really was going to go to every single town you went to every single town at some point, so start to finish and the publish date is 2017. When did you start the project to get each town to get all your information to final print Ready to go?

Unknown Speaker 22:49
It was almost a three years over two and a half year project. Wow. And there were a few of them. That I’ll give you a good example. Place reville California, it’s a great story. I did not go to place her Ville. But I did get some, some help. Some, some writers out there that I was able to contact and assisted me in that one. But it was such a good story that I knew I needed to get it in the book that I thought the chances of me getting out the place or villain in the near future. Just it wasn’t going to happen. I wanted it in the book. And that’s how we got it. But most of them were were visits of at least one time, sometimes more, much more than that, to get everything I needed

Suburban Folk 23:41
to hopefully if somebody’s trying to hit all these places and won’t take them two to three years. Obviously you got a lot of work to do. And you got to get to them. But I was just curious of amassing the data of how long that would

Unknown Speaker 23:51
be. Yeah, well, and I think you know, there you’re going to find Let’s face it, Coca Cola started in Atlantic Georgia and obviously the south, southeast. You know, that’s where the bulk of the real old CocaCola history is. And as I do book number two, I am trying to move further north. And the History Although it’s not as antique is not as ancient, is there are deep stories in towns like when ohto Minnesota, you know, Minneapolis, places like that. That will be in the next book. But if you’re going to have if you’re going to head out looking for own Coca Cola history, you know, it’s Alabama, Georgia, Mississippi, the Carolinas, that’s where it started. Tennessee the chapter chapter three, I think it is a book on Chattanooga, Tennessee gives a lot of the reason why Coca Cola grew with the independent bottlers that really sets the mood for what followed with Coca Cola.

Suburban Folk 25:10
It’s nice to see in that chapter you outlining not only the bottlers but a couple of the other businesses that were able to grow in the area as a result of the bottling particular Glass Company. I think also, I’m gonna say Lumber Company. That’s not exactly right. But the company that was building like the crates and being able to store that so right, that’s cool to see, you know, just sort of how there’s outgrowth, even from one industry into another.

Unknown Speaker 25:36
Well, you had, you know, like Cavalier, the vending machine company that started out because of Coca Cola in Chattanooga, there’s, there’s I I say to people, there’s almost as much Coca Cola history in Chattanooga, as there is in Atlanta from a variety of reasons that it’s it’s the to still be called I think it it’s a very interesting and they refer to the locals refer to Chattanooga as Coca Cola money, because there was indeed a lot of wealthy people in Chattanooga because of their involvement with the brand Coca Cola. You know that the interesting thing of that chapter is how it all happened and that’s the fact that there was the two attorneys from Coca Cola coming from Chattanooga, that finally convinced Coca Cola to sell them the rights to bottle Coca Cola you know, Coca Cola thought it was kind of a dumb idea really a sick and or that and but he gave in and sold the rights to these two attorneys from Chattanooga for $1 and it said he never collected the dollar. So here, he’s got to No, girl, young gentleman go back to Canada. And they don’t have the rights to bottle Coca Cola throughout the United States. And they probably between the two of them have 1500 dollars. And they’re saying, how are we going to get this accomplished? There is the reason that Coca Cola grew because they said to themselves, wait a minute, we’ve got the rights. Let’s just sell the rights. And that’s how it happened. They started selling the territories. You know, it’s like you mentioned Paducah. The gentleman who bought the Paducah franchise 5050 mile area actually met these two, Chattanooga, entrepreneurs while working on the decline railroad in Chattanooga, you know, and he said you That sounds good. I think I’ll buy the territory for Paducah. So, that’s really how it all got started. Kind of early days for franchising.

Suburban Folk 28:07
Also, while we’re on the bottling in the, in the glass companies in Chattanooga, there’s an interesting section around how the coke bottle came to be actually let me back up a little bit even before that that, you know, for people like me that probably most people when you think of coke there is of course that very distinct classic bottle. And what you point out very early on, you know, like you said in the very beginnings of the 1890s we’re not talking about what we think of today have a glass bottle that you can throw in the recycling. These are very thick bottles, I think we’re mostly corked with a cork and then I know you talk about like the metal wire that’s in there, which I’m sure had considerations for taste potentially altering as well as even contaminants and then ultimately, it’s a town in Indiana again, keep me honest here that into the competition,

Unknown Speaker 29:04
right Terre Haute? Well that that in itself is an interesting story. And again, one of the ancestors was a sentence of the family that actually created that bottle. It helps me a great deal and putting that story together. But to summarize, by the 1900s, the bottling of cola had become pretty popular and there were there were other brands popping up. You had Cheryl Cole and you just people like that people were imitating, to some degree, the Coca Cola aspect, giving it names. It sounded like Coca Cola well and bottling that there was no set standard for bottling, there’s whatever the bottlers could get That’s what they put their beverage again. Coca Cola realized that was helping to confuse the public as to is it really a corporate? Is it something else? And so they issued to the glassmakers a challenge. We want a bottle that when people pick up that bottle, they know it’s a Coca Cola. It has to be our bottle and to be used only by our bottlers. Well, there were five bottle manufacturers that entered the competition. And the ones that ultimately worn out was the root Bottling Company in Terre Haute, Indiana. They design that specific bottle that we’re familiar with now. It went to a bottlers convention in 1905, along with five other entries, and it was selected At that point in 1906, it went into production and became the bottle for Coca Cola, smart move by Coca Cola. And that Bottling Company then not only bottled for Coca Cola but the rights to bottle that bottle to manufacturer that bottle by other glass companies was made available for a C and consequently you had the company like the bottle company in Chattanooga, that became a major producer of the Coca Cola bottle. But they were initially were paying a fee to bottle to make that bottle to the root Glass Company in Terre Haute, Indiana. Also that late and I’d have to look at binos utility exact year, but I think it was in the 30s that Coca Cola purchased the rights to the bottle and made it available To all the battlers instead of it coming from the right song by the root Glass Company. But the root family itself is a tremendously interesting story. And the chapter in the book is called root, the Bible and the boggler because they also became a major boggler and became involved in many other things that were familiar with, such as the Indianapolis 500, etc, auto racing, so they’re quite a family and we try to detail that family in our

Suburban Folk 32:39
wonder, like you mentioned in the beginning, you know, canler didn’t necessarily have bottling on his radar up into, you know, this point of having a proprietary coke bottle that again, you know, we all are aware of today. Not that this would be something you would highlight in the book, but when you were doing your research Was there ever any call call it a cross section between the Coca Cola company getting their arms around, you know, that proprietary bottle and like you said sort of weeding out counterfeits or you know, whatever else might be going on, while they were, again, getting their arms around the overall process and managing, I guess the independent bottlers

Unknown Speaker 33:20
will, you know, they didn’t realize that it was to their advantage to have a bottle that would be recognizable as their product because they were finding in their own communities competition that was claiming to have the same quality as a Coca Cola and using whatever bottle they could use, and that there were there were some bottlers that actually went to Coca Cola corporate and succeeded in having Coca Cola corporate threaten the legal action to shut some of these down. I think probably the best example was, there was a drink called Purell CAGR cola and Coca Cola, for whatever reason, saw them as a major threat. And because they were becoming fairly big they were, they were having their own bottlers and so forth. And Coca Cola was successful in getting them to change the name of that drink. Ultimately, that boggler became the kneehigh Bottling Company. And then they also became a name that are still familiar with, which is RC cola. But it was started out as true and was a competitive threat. list is viewed by Coca Cola They did try to add the bottlers, you know, supported 100% the need for proprietary identification. You know, there was no doubt about that. So there was never a problem in Coca Cola encouraging the bottlers to us the new bottle that had been designed.

Suburban Folk 35:21
And that’s an interesting relationship because I found my mind comparing these stories to today’s craft beer stories. Maybe it’s just me, maybe it’s just because it’s always in the news. And of course, it’s the opposite, right? When you say Anheuser Busch compared to independent craft breweries, it is definitely a competitive relationship, to say the least. So yeah, sort of switching my mind to it being Coca Cola and the independent bars being on the same side admittedly took a little bit for me to get and I think even when, you know, there’s acknowledgments of buyouts, consolidations and things like that. I sort of wonder like, Oh, you know, Was this sort of a hostile takeover? Or how how collegial was was the relationships through the years with these independent bottlers and coca cola?

Unknown Speaker 36:08
Well, there were two times that there was a tense relationship. It changed depending on the ownership the presidency of Coca Cola. There was one instance where the President of Coca Cola pretty aggressive, told the Coca Cola bottlers that he didn’t think that their contract was forever that it could be with it could be cancelled at any time. Well, now remember that the bottling contracts didn’t come specifically from Coca Cola corporate. They came from the the companies, the two companies that were selling up by the two individuals that obtain the rights to sell coke bottled Coca Cola. So you didn’t buy if you had the plant in Paducah. You didn’t buy your rights the bottle from Coca Cola corporate, you bought it from one of those to what they call parent bottlers that the two gentlemen that obtained the exclusive rights to bottle Coca Cola. So in the end the families of those two initial the sons of well one case of some other cases nephew then became the owners and controllers of those parent companies. And they defended the independent bottlers and fought off any attempt by Coca Cola to take away those contracts. They were successful. Another time. They were successful. And standing up for the bottlers against Coca Cola corporate was when there was the sugar crisis. And the price of sugar was going up. And and Coca Cola wanted to greatly increase the price of the syrup. And there was quite a battle on that. And again, there was a compromise but it was because the bottlers had the two parent bottlers doing defending them. So it wasn’t always harmonious. But most of the time, Coca Cola corporate was extremely glad to have the bottlers and at one point, got pretty aggressive and buying some of the bottlers out because they realized the potential and some of the bottlers, we’re ready to sell. So it Coca Cola went through a stage of buying independent bottlers and it actually got too much for them. You know, Coca Cola had forgot that what really made Coca Cola is the fact that the bottlers were so involved in their communities and Coca Cola starting in the late 80s, and even up through the 90s and even recently, has sold back or formed relationships to give territories back to existing independent bottlers because the fact is, the independent bottlers can cover the territory and provide the service a lot better and and it took Coca Cola while I think this was just my opinion, to realize That was the case. And it certainly is reflected in the fact that a lot of the independent bottlers now have territories that they regained from Coca Cola.

Suburban Folk 40:12
Well, given what you seem to see with business stories nowadays, that’s sort of a refreshing story to be able to tell that it is going back to the independence that can handle it and sort of, you know, know their business. And hopefully even from there, again, when we profile sort of these smaller towns, you know, they’re able to keep their viability. So that is definitely a nice story to be able to tell, focusing in on the different business owners, the independent bottlers and, you know, like you mentioned, there is a theme on family so that’s something I definitely got from the book that in like most cases, sure, there were some that that sold the business out but there are also many that kept the business within their family Are there other characteristics that you noticed as you were doing your research that group these folks together? Were they were they true visionaries. Let’s say that they zeroed in on Coca Cola compared to like you said there’s other things being bottled at the time all most of them had an existing Bottling Company. Just Yeah. What what similarities Did you see across the board with the different folks getting into this business? Well, yeah,

Unknown Speaker 41:26
I did. I saw two things. There were those that had existing bottling companies. And they cautiously approach the idea of adding Coca Cola as one of the things they would bottle and many of them tell the same story about when they first started bottling Coca Cola, when they would send a case of, you know, 11, SAS barillo, whatever orange to one of their customers, they would slip in a couple bottles of Coca Cola Well, to get them to try it, and that was kind of a common practice. So you have the existing bottlers who consciously put together something here. Let’s try it. That but they had a business. So they were already moving in that area bottling. Then you have the young entrepreneur who heard of a beverage that sounded like it was something different. And there was an opportunity, and many of them scraped together whatever dollars they could to buy a franchise. In fact, there were. We talked about the two parent bottlers, one of those parent bottlers actually sold half of his company to a gentleman in Chattanooga, who would then also set up independent bottlers. Many times he would select friends, even relatives. And if they didn’t have the money to complete the deal, he put up the money. In return, he would get 50 or even larger percent of the bottling business. So he in fact, created a bottling Empire. That by setting up other bottlers providing some of the funding and taking a partial ownership, he became In fact, the largest independent Coca Cola bottler in the country. And when Coca Cola started buying Coca Cola, distributors, Coca Cola, independent bottlers, by that time this company had passed down to a third generation and there was a Not much desire to continue the business with a lot of desire to obtain the value of the business. Coca Cola corporate bought that entire entity for 1.3 with a be billion dollars and that that is part of that Coca Cola money in Chattanooga that they talk about. So there were there were a lot of people that benefited financially by getting on board with Coca Cola and and that who bought half away half became extremely wealthy doing it. And I

Suburban Folk 44:42
know you end a lot of the chapters with ultimately, you know, what the families did with their business or the business owners I should say. And yeah, like you said, you calculate out whether it’s that big 1.2 billion, I know there are a couple other calculations for stock that that some owners had received even in Coca Cola and what it would be worth, you know, hundred years later Now, of course, easy for, you know me to read and say, Oh man, that’s, you know, like a lottery ticket. But hey, you know, you don’t necessarily know that at the time, especially if, you know you have somebody offering to buy it for whatever amount and you know, that’ll make you set at that point, but it is. Yeah, very interesting to read that and say, Man, you know, they really picked a winner here. What would have been the risk at the time of bottling coca cola? Was it just really an unknown flavor, or just unknown brand? Again, the other sodas had already been out there. So I guess it’s almost a two part question. What would have been the perceived risk for people that said, Okay, yeah, we’re going to bottle this and we’re going to try that. And then on the other end once they did do it, any thoughts for what did ultimately make Coca Cola stand out for The other sodas that were already being bottled and distributed,

Unknown Speaker 46:03
why the ultimate risk, you know, with the immediate risk, rather is that of starting a business, you know, a business you’ve never been in. How do I do it, you know, and you buy whatever bottling equipment lot of boost whether the early days, all of it was hand operated, you know, a foot pedal and you know, it carbonation. And, you know, they talk about those early plants, sometimes that the bottlers you know, would work was screen mesh over their face because the carbonation sometimes would cause the bottles to explode. So you had you had that initial risk of financing a startup starting a plant and, and then once you get your product made, how do you get how do you distribute it? No, buy it from you. You don’t want to sell a bottle to the man on the street. Court, you want to sell a case to the drug store on the street corner? You know, the gentleman in Ghibli go back to Paducah. His first case that he bottled, he took it to his neighborhood drug story, do the man there well, and convinced him to just put the case out on display and see if anybody would buy it, and then pay me afterwards. And that’s what a lot of them do. They did whatever they could to get the product sampled. And it was not an immediate thing of Oh, this is great, because the flavor was so unique. But once people really got used to the flavor of Coca Cola, they demanded it, and from there it went, but how do you know that when you’re starting a business and you take your first case of product to a drugstore, and the man accepts it only because he’s your friend, and he’s feel sorry for you. And he could do himself. I don’t know about this, but we’ll do this for all Joe, you know. And so that’s the battle they had, they had an unknown commodity. And they had to convince, you know, people it was good Unfortunately, the Coca Cola company, even in the early years, believed in promotion and advertising. You know, I mentioned in the book and one of my sections about signs, old Coca Cola signs, Isa Candler one time said to a movie producer in Hollywood. It will be to the point that you will not be able to produce a film outside without getting a Coca Cola side of the background.

Unknown Speaker 49:04
You look around you, they’re everywhere.

Suburban Folk 49:07
And I remember reading that exact quote. And then of course, goes on for the history where you talk about Times Square. And of course, now I can absolutely picture you know, the massive Coca Cola advertising there, which even tying back to total, what would have been the risk for the businesses, I think it’s hard for us to sit here, knowing what a household name it is, and imagining any point in time when it would have been considered a risky venture. But you know, to your point, like it was certainly and especially for folks that are sort of getting into the business for the first time

Unknown Speaker 49:40
we talked about the bottle. I want to digress there, because I’m going to give you a little something that’s in the second book that’s coming out great. The cold and cold bottle is green. Right? It is a green tint to it. And why And why is that? Well, we told the story in Book number two, but reason is, remember there was a person the company that created that bottle was in Terre Haute, Indiana. One of the things they owned was a a sand quarry about 50 miles away from Terre Haute and they would get the sand to make the bottles at that quarry. What as it happened that particular Corey, which ironically is located there at all gold. Greencastle had minerals within the sand that created the green tint in the bottle. Coca Cola like that so well. They initially called the color German green, and then I guess they thought better of that and they call the Georgia green but in any case, they specified two other bottle battle facts That if you make a bottle and your sand does not have the minerals, then you must add them so that the bottle will be green. And that’s that’s why the Coca Cola bottle has that green tint to it the original bottles

Suburban Folk 51:17
on imagine that’s around 20s 30s 40s. So yeah, you’re right, the the German name probably didn’t go so well in

Unknown Speaker 51:25
that time period, though they, they decided that was not a good decision. But in any case, again, it’s it’s how things sort of piece together to create this, this iconic symbol of Coca Cola. A lot of it was, I don’t want to say accidental but certainly was not in the plan.

Suburban Folk 51:47
And again, tying back to just even the theme of the book in general. It’s cool that Terre Haute happened to have that as a signature of the town or at least of the people doing the bottling that they won that competition And now it’s a forever signature and what we have in our mind as you know, standard Coca Cola and been part of their brand so it’s really cool, I think, to see that as a particular part of the country. This was you know where their story was with Coca Cola and just in again American history, and then that, you know, made its way through even into today.

Unknown Speaker 52:22
Well, there’s a lot of Coca Cola history in Indiana. If you’re looking at an adventure, payroll is a great place to visit. They have just built a new museum Historical Museum downtown, they have a large section that deals with as they call it, the birth of the Coca Cola bottle which it is that town and the town is has a celebration once a year. In honor of that. You’ll find large Coca Cola bottles painted out throughout The city they, they are very proud of their Coca Cola bottle heritage, and it’s a great little city to visit. They certainly certainly take advantage of that, that history. And there’s there’s other places in Indiana as well. With Coca Cola history. The bottling plant in Indianapolis, for example, when it was built was one of the largest, most artistically creative plants ever. In fact, all of the official from Coca Cola corporate turned out for the grand opening of that plant. And it’s it stands today it is the whole area has been converted into a rather unique redo downtown area. So again, it’s it’s something worth seeing Indiana. There’s a lot of bottlers in Indiana for whatever reason that have unique stories. And we’re going to cover some more of them in the second book. So this is so you find that you find this throughout the South in the new south to find a lot of Coca Cola history

Suburban Folk 54:13
going off of that, as far as the celebrations and the overall interest in Coca Cola history, American history. Can you talk a little bit about Coca Cola enthusiasts, collectors historians? What have you found sort of getting into that community and what is it like they

Unknown Speaker 54:34
are amazing. They they’re cool CocaCola collector chapters throughout the least in every state in some states are several. There are collector groups in Australia. In fact, some of them have bought the book from me. They’re in Japan, they’re in China, they’re everywhere. Canada and and what they collect Amazing. They have been able to find treasures that were limited production two and three item productions have been able to find them and preserve them. They have annually. They have a big convention. This year the convention will be July 7 through the 11th. in Green Bay, Wisconsin, all of these collectors will come together. They will have rooms at the hotel where they will swap back and forth. And then on the Saturday of the convention, there is a big its first it’s open only to collectors and then to the public. A large trade show if you want to call it swap meet whatever. But if you are looking for or if you are interested in Coca Cola memorabilia, that these are the people, their conventions are the places to go but the chapters throughout the country will have their annual sometimes twice a year. conventions gathering swapping, where again, you meet interesting, interesting people. They’re not only interesting because they collect this iconic trademark, but because in the process of collecting it, they learned stories about it. They don’t stories what where did it come from? They’re a great source of information of history of Coca Cola, because the history comes with the items by second book. In fact, I was working on the chapter last night. There’s a gentleman who has a museum just outside of Decatur, Illinois. He started collecting by accident about 30 years ago, and he got addicted to it. And his Museum which was just Opening has items in it that are, I don’t want to say one of a kind, but one of five or one of 12, this type of thing, and certainly worth visiting. And again, it’s a case where someone got involved because you saw a poster, it attracted his attention. And the next thing he started talking to the Coca Cola collectors, they’re a great group of people. And they have a world of information, and they’ll share it with you and you. In the meantime, you can see touch by if you want to some pretty unique products. So yeah, Coca Cola collectors. What again, the success of Coca Cola. What other brand has that extensive group of people that collected there are people Let’s collect you know, Beer memorabilia. I know a lot of them well, in fact, I used to dabble with that. There are people with collect certain beverages vernors, Ginger Ale, Dr. Pepper, etc. But there is no group as large or as enthusiastic or as worldwide as a Coca Cola collectors. There are quite a group and anybody who’s at all interested, you don’t have to collect to be interested, but you would certainly enjoy visiting with them.

Suburban Folk 58:35
Yet another theme of the book is by proxy, you get a really nice slice of American history with it as well. So maybe if, you know researching Coca Cola hadn’t occurred to a particular person, you know, there’s plenty here that can you know, pique your interest in other sort of American history. One other quick anecdote from the book. You talk About one of the plants that was bottling coke for POW is German POW during World War Two. And it sounds like that’s how they had their real kickstart. And you have to remind me that the town that that one was in, but again, you get sort of that relative to what was going on at the time.

Unknown Speaker 59:18
Well, yeah, that was Ellis Ville, Alabama. And in fact, there’s a museum there it is worth visiting. Because the Museum The City Museum, is located in the old Coca Cola plants. And some of the original Coca Cola bottling equipment is still in that museum on display, and it’s kept up for people to see and and learn about the bottling. But the unique thing, when you talk about the prisoners of war, Aliceville, Alabama, had one of the largest POW camps in the in the south at that time, and the reserves. The German prisoners were brought there, and they didn’t know what to expect they they anticipated harsh treatment. Instead, you know, this Coca Cola plant was excluded from the sugar rationing of the war and was allowed to bottle 24 hours a day of deep be to make sure that not only the prisoners of war but our boys who watched them had plenty of Coca Cola to drink during the war. And many of those many, but some of them some of the German prisoners were so amazed at the treatment that they received that they stayed in Alabama after they loved it, you know, they want to go home. And again, maybe it’s that old Coca Cola with a smile thing I don’t know, but it certainly it certainly played a part in our Ville Alabama, it’s a great little museum to see and, and it not only features Coca Cola history, but it has a lot of history and things that were made by the prisoners at that POW camp. So it has a lot of that history there as well. It’s a good museum to visit. It’s it should be on your bucket list.

Suburban Folk 1:01:27
Very cool. I will make sure to highlight that one. That is most of the questions that I had for you. I had a great time talking with you and I really enjoyed reading the book. I’m excited to hear that there’s a part two coming before we sign off Do you want to go ahead and give your information how folks can contact you. If you have a release date coming for is the the follow up to the Coca Cola trail or any other books you’re working on.

Unknown Speaker 1:01:54
right the the new book, by target is the avid reading For the Green Bay could could in July, I think will make that current book and the future book will be available at my website which is simply CocaCola trail.com it is available through Amazon. I have a wonderful publisher who was in Pennsylvania by the way the book will be available. I’m finding it in many of the museums are buying it, especially museums in the towns or we’ve written about Coca Cola, the gift stores are buying it a lot of the country stores that have if you walk in and there’s a Coca Cola sign on the wall of that store for sale you you may find our book there as well. So it’s kind of a hidden Miss thing. It’s not a Barnes and Noble you know, it’s a lot of books a billion. We’re a different animal or, or travel a collectors type thing, but we sold a lot of them and We’re looking forward to same thing with issue number two, which I guess we’ll probably just simply call back on the trail or people in places. And again, it’s it’s a joy to do, I’ll certainly

Suburban Folk 1:03:14
keep a lookout for it. And when we released the episode, of course, will put your website on the show notes as well as a link to the Amazon page. And you know, like you said, if there’s other outlets we should include, we’ll go ahead and do that as well. Well, Larry, again, I really appreciate you taking some time to talk to us today. And anything we missed before we sign off.

Unknown Speaker 1:03:34
No, we could do this all morning. Great, but I take it up a lot for your time and, and I appreciate the opportunity to share these memories with you, Greg. It’s been a lot of fun. And we’ll keep you posted on future Coca Cola.

Suburban Folk 1:03:51
Yeah, absolutely. You know, as you get closer to book release, if you’d like to come back on, I would love to

Unknown Speaker 1:03:55
have me We’ll do that and I appreciate it. Thank you, Greg here. 2020 Cheers.

Suburban Folk 1:04:02
If you enjoyed this episode, please be sure to give us a rating on Apple, Spotify, Stitcher, or wherever you get podcasts. If you’d like to be notified of future weekly shows, please hit the subscribe button. Thank you. Suburban Folk is part of the pod all the time podcasting, network,

Unknown Speaker 1:04:18
ghosts spective, whatever you want to call them, they’ve been around for thousands of years. Apparently she died from a tooth infection in one of the upstairs rooms in the house. The locations the history of the haunting podcasts tells you all about these famous infamous homes famous locations when they became terrifying places to visit. Grab a glass of wine and settle in with your hosts, Archie. I mean, that was definitely the wrong thing to do. And carry. Nobody asked for it. Nobody’s liking

Unknown Speaker 1:04:52
my podcast and I’ll save it.

Unknown Speaker 1:04:55
People just winging it in life and this podcast So enjoy this week’s episode.

Unknown Speaker 1:05:03
History of a haunting

Transcribed by https://otter.ai